Feminism in the 21st Century

So, browsing the “recently posted” feature on the Dashboard I found the following post (and, consequently, the accompanying blog).

Let’s start with the post. As may or may not have become clear I’m “pro-choice”. Why? Well, it basically boils down to the Randian argument. Valuing actual life more than potential life. On the other hand, we get something like this:

In other words, this essentially allowed doctors to treat women and human beings who can think for themselves and make their own decisions, especially when it came to their bodies and their reproductive rights. We were no longer viewed as animals incapable of free thought and I’d like it to remain this way, for my sake and for my future daughters-should I have one- sake.

Which so hilariously misses the point it’s not even funny anymore. The gist of the argument by opponents is that abortion is murder. Now, personally I don’t accept that – partly because there’s no science to back it up (Christian nutjobs burning to prove me wrong: fuck off already) and partly (more importantly) because the fetus is a “parasite” latching onto the woman. It’s incapable of surviving outside of the woman’s body, it’s basically still part of the woman. Or, in the words of the Ayatollah: it’s only a potential life, not an actual life. Obviously, there comes a point where the fetus is capable of surviving outside of the woman’s body but seeing how rare those cases of late-term abortions are, I’m not really bothered by them (and the lack of justification for them) – just have the abortion already if you’re going to have it. (Incidentally, I’d personally only consider an abortion in one case – and in that one case I’d push real hard for it (think: it’s me or the baby). What case? Well, I’ll let Tucker Max say it:

Her “NO! You’re mean! What would you do if you had a retarded child?”
Me “I’d bash it’s head against a rock, and have another kid.”

Yes, I’m a horrible person.)

Anyway, back to our warrior-feminist. There’s obviously no case of human beings “thinking for themselves” when we’re talking about murder – while I might consider someone dying a good idea, that’s not really a choice I can make. So, the major point really isn’t addressed at all – if it’s a person, then you can’t abort it. If it isn’t – then you can. Why does it bother me? Well, terms like “reproductive rights” are bound to make my head spin.

Which brings us to the more general problem. What the fuck is it with feminism in the 21st century? What’s the bloody point? I really don’t get it. It might be a case of confusing positive with negative freedom (more on that later) but basically this is about as silly as the Iranian delegate to the UN’s human rights council telling Switzerland they really ought to improve their human rights situation. It’s strangely entertaining in a sick way but it really misses the point.

Let’s look at what feminists might complain about in the west today – which is what they enjoy doing most, not making reasonable claims about some backwater shithole (read: Muslim countries, African countries) doing all kinds of horrible shit.

  • Women get paid less than men.

First of all, I consider this to be freedom of contract. There’s obviously no real reason to do this – apart from the fact that women really want to have their cake and eat it too. Let’s be honest: you can’t have a career and be a really caring mother. Sure, you might muddle through (I expect to) but if you want to live up to the high standards you’ve set, you won’t be able to put in the kind of hours that’s necessary for a real career. Obviously, my vision of a real career might differ somewhat from your’s. Solution? The Japanese way. Offer a motherhood and a career track. Give women a real choice. You want to have children? Well, we’re not gonna pick up the tab. You want to play with the boys? Sure, be our guest but NO CHILDREN.

That’s about everything I can come up with, too. There’s probably some other stupid bullshit about religion keeping women down (leave the church already – I’m in the process of doing so myself (or as a friend put it last night: so you’re lazily thinking about it)), husbands being evil shits who don’t do any work around the house, general attitudes in society being bad towards women, and going in all kinds of whacko dircetions from there, complaints about everything from pornography to women being whores and getting called out while men can sleep around and be respected for it.

Anyway, let’s finish this one. I basically consider feminism evil for the same reason “black pride” is evil: it’s collectivist. It’s about a (made-up) group rather than the individual. You want something special qua being female. This is where positive freedom comes into play. The government “oughta do something”. This leads to such rich stories as there being more female graduates than male graduates and yet men get all the decent jobs – here’s a hint: Women’s Studies isn’t gonna land you any kind of decent job. It’s a dead end.

Here are another ten worthless majors. And here are some more.

Interesting to see how many engineering majors are on that list. Or economics. Biology. Chemistry. What, you don’t see them on there? NEITHER DO I!

Most of those majors listed are incredibly popular with women and emos. The same people who bitch about the world. See the fucking link?

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6 Responses to “Feminism in the 21st Century”

  1. Lissette Says:

    I think you’re the one that’s “missing the point”, especially when you make statements as:

    “Let’s be honest: you can’t have a career and be a really caring mother. ”

    Why is it possible for men to have a career, be a caring father, AND get paid what they deserve, and when women try to do the same we’re viewed as bitchy, whiny, feminists with nothing better to do? This is one of the reasons why there are feminists in the world still.

    As for reproductive rights making your head spin, why should it? Would you appreciate being given a vasectomy simply because the government feels that you shouldn’t reproduce simply because of your race, color, social status, whatever else? Would you want to be stuck with a child you couldn’t care for simply because the government says you had to? Would you like to not have access to condoms because some moralistic (let’s reverse the roles here a bit) woman on a seat high up decided you didn’t need access to condoms because it’s not part of her values?

    I’m sorry if you think feminism is a waste of time, but I feel that your lack of esteem and your need to control is a waste of time as well.

    Maybe we should make history lessons in school all about the history of women and maybe we should teach our children about the great female authors, painters, musicians, politicians from history and conveniently leave out the men from this.

    “Most of those majors listed are incredibly popular with women and emos. The same people who bitch about the world. See the fucking link?”

    This is my favorite line in the whole post, because here you are bitching about women in the world and simultaneously bitching about those who bitch, so where do you fall in that equation?

  2. midmull Says:

    Why is it possible for men to have a career, be a caring father, AND get paid what they deserve, and when women try to do the same we’re viewed as bitchy, whiny, feminists with nothing better to do?
    – It isn’t. That’s the point. Men aren’t “caring fathers” when they have a real career. You can’t. It’s not possible – sure you try (as will or at least might I) but the math simply doesn’t work out. If you’re working anywhere from 80 to 120 hours a week, well there just isn’t any time. It’s as simple as that.
    Now you can start blaming evil, evil corporations for being demanding – and that’s when I get annoyed. It’s not the corporation’s job to subsidize your lifestyle choice.

    As for reproductive rights making your head spin, why should it? – Not because of what you associate with it but simply for the term itself. It’s a collectivist approach. Having rights qua being a woman, not qua being human.

    I’m sorry if you think feminism is a waste of time, but I feel that your lack of esteem and your need to control is a waste of time as well. – I feel absolutely no need to control. Read the post – I’m even “pro-choice”. I’m simply scared by the collectivist approach that lies behind it. I’m fairly hardcore libertarian – there’s very little danger in terms of negative freedom coming from me. Now, if you’re talking about getting stuff from someone else, that gets a bit trickier.

    Maybe we should make history lessons in school all about the history of women and maybe we should teach our children about the great female authors, painters, musicians, politicians from history and conveniently leave out the men from this. – Doesn’t the US already do this? Black History month or something? It’d be the same approach. Amusing if it weren’t so sad. I’m not gonna tell anyone how to teach history (see – libertarianism: schools are private which means you can even teach creationism! Or just feminism! Whatever it is you want to do – as long as you find someone to pay the bill, that is (and it’s not gonna be “the public”)) but it’s not exactly the most efficient approach. History is history – you teach children about it and you don’t use it as a fucking propaganda tool.

    This is my favorite line in the whole post, because here you are bitching about women in the world and simultaneously bitching about those who bitch, so where do you fall in that equation? – Wrong. I’m not bitching about “women” in general. I’m bitching about feminists. Besides, I’m a huge fan of ranting and overgeneralizing. 😉

  3. Lissette Says:

    There is such a think as a caring father who has a career and earns his pay, and my fiance is a good example of such. There’s a balance that needs to be found, and that goes for anything. He’s found a job that pays him incredibly well and doesn’t put those kinds of demands on him, yet if he’s needed he’s there. The jobs that require your soul upon entrance to the company is not for all people, and you’re going to a far extreme when you suggest such. We’re talking about a John who does job A and has a kid, is there for said kid and get’s paid X amount of dollars, and then you have Jane who works job A as well with same corporation as John, has a kid, is there for said kid and get paid X – $0.40 to the dollar of what John gets paid given the same experience. I’m talking about EQUALITY for men AND for women, which is something people think has already been reached but has not once you look at actual, bona fide FACTS.

    – Doesn’t the US already do this? Black History month or something? It’d be the same approach. Amusing if it weren’t so sad. I’m not gonna tell anyone how to teach history (see – libertarianism: schools are private which means you can even teach creationism! Or just feminism! Whatever it is you want to do – as long as you find someone to pay the bill, that is (and it’s not gonna be “the public”)) but it’s not exactly the most efficient approach. History is history – you teach children about it and you don’t use it as a fucking propaganda tool.

    You think segregating the history of an entire group of people to one month is really enough???!! We also have Hispanic History month in the US too, but I think a lot more happened within Hispanic history than what you can fit in one month, not to mention that what they even teach these kids in school about any of this stuff is a watered down version of the truth.

    This is not a propaganda tool, it’s the TRUTH. History as it’s being taught to our children is the history from a white male perspective, not a Native American woman/man, not a Spanish woman/man, not a Black woman/man, a white man, and that’s all that anybody seems to be content with teaching. I think it’s completely biased and unfair, and I think in a society that is so full of different cultures that the school system should be able to teach the history of PEOPLE not just the white anglo men who came over here from Britain and fought the big, bad Indians for their right to survive. Besides, it’s much more than just that. It’s about teaching kids where they come from, their heritage, and giving them self esteem in knowing that where they come from is just as important as where the white man came from. It’s also about teaching girls that they’re not just regulated to being housewives that there’s women out there who fought for them to be much more than just housewives. That there’s women out there who fought to make sure they could become educated and they don’t have to be proper and kind and do everything a man says. It IS about control and I’m sorry you can’t see outside the box.

    In truth, within said box it’s not just women who are being oppressed, it’s different races, and even men, because men are regulated to playing certain roles in societies, and the moment they’re not doing their “manly duties” they’re seen as queers, whether they are or not. I’m not just about freedom for women, I’m about freedom for everyone, I just happen to relate more to women because that is what I am, as I also relate to Latins, as that’s what I am too.

    As to your comment about a degree in Woman’s studies being a waste of time, I know plenty of broke, homeless engineers/architects, and one lawyer who surviving off his wife, so don’t generalize degrees from something you read from some blog that doesn’t even have any facts attached to their opinions. It’s about how you market yourself that really matters not the degree you hold.

    As for “reproductive rights”-because that is what they are, your right to reproduce when you want should you ever want to-the facts are that there are no picket lines for men to not get vasectomies, condoms are readily available and free in most instances, but when it comes to a woman needing an abortion she has to run the gauntlet of protesters condemning her for her choice, she has to jump through hoops in order to get the pill/ring/shot/etc. in order to avoid becoming pregnant in the first place, and once she does get the prescription to get her birth control, she has to hope and pray that the pharmacist is not going to be on some moral trip about birth control not being part of God’s plan and refusing to fill her medication.

    The fact of the matter is that unless you’re a woman you don’t know nor understand what a woman has to go through in her daily lives. I don’t know what things are like in the UK, but come over to the states and escort a woman to an abortion clinic, or attempt to get her some birth control that is not condoms and see where that’ll lead you.

  4. midmull Says:

    I will respond to this – some time. Busy.

  5. midmull Says:

    Okay, now.

    Salaries: just two more points.
    1) I don’t really care what people earn. I’ve touched this in the original post, it’s a question of freedom of contract, as far as I’m concerned. The only reason I really picked this is that it was the only thing that came to mind as blatant “discrimination” (btw, I’d love to hear some more – seriously, we’re open-minded here (albeit aggressive, as you might’ve found out;)), check out daniel’s conversion into a homeschooling-fan)
    2) The only jobs I care about don’t really discriminate against women. At least not unreasonably. Thoise are, obviously, rather high-end and very professional. Sure, you still hit a wall as a woman when you’ve got a child (because, quite simply, you can’t offer the same dedication that a child-less yuppie can) but that makes sense.

    Anyway, on we go.
    Education: as mentioned in the first post, I’m for private education. You’re free to teach your children what you’d like to teach them (for example that the US gov invented AIDS to kill African-Americans) – you just aren’t free to force my children to learn the BS you think constitutes history. There’s no female perspective to “Stalin had millions of people killed” – in the end they’re dead and that’s that.

    As for womanly men: I don’t give a shit. You’re free to act as you please (usual libertarian qualifier of not interfering with other people’s freedom, obviously) but you aren’t free from the consequences of your actions.

    Condoms: the catholic church vehemently disagrees with you. Alas, that’s not the point. I simply find the term rather stupid. As I’ve already said: I’m “pro-choice” (don’t like that phrase either for some reason) – but let’s not kid each other. Rational people won’t really get into a situation where they need one.

    Finally, about degrees. You really amuse me here. Now, I obviously don’t have such an in-depth knowledge of US statistics but all the statistics I’ve seen for “’round here” (which isn’t the UK, btw) send a very clear message: social sciences = you’re fucked (something like 7-10% unemployment), engineering = you’re doing great. Same (though not as much) goes for law and business. Obviously, there’ll be exceptions but that doesn’t say anything about things are in general.

  6. danielquenton Says:

    I always find it rather funny to read (or hear, for that matter) feminists demanding a better world for themselves, which is not a bad thing, don’t get me wrong, but accompanied by the always present “all people are equal” or “everyone should be free” attitude it just sounds very hypocritical to me.

    Now, let my explain by example:

    [i]”You think segregating the history of an entire group of people to one month is really enough???!! We also have Hispanic History month in the US too, but I think a lot more happened within Hispanic history than what you can fit in one month, not to mention that what they even teach these kids in school about any of this stuff is a watered down version of the truth.”[/i]

    All right, let’s be fair then: So, let’s see, what we have here: We surely need American History, I mean it’s the country. And we would also need the History of the native American people.
    Then we need all the histories of the immigrants into the U.S., or at least the histories of the more important immigrant groups (wouldn’t that be unfair though?).
    So we have Hispanic History, as you suggested, that includes the occupation of south america and we would therefore have to have the histories of the native south-america cultures, Mayan, and Azthekian, just to name a few.
    Then Mexican History, European History (Which is probably bigger than all we’ve had so far) and African History…

    What I’m saying is, that they can’t teach everything. And when you’re saying, that they should teach more Hispanic history, because you’re of Hispanic origin, that’s all right with me. (As long they don’t make a law saying that everyone has to do that, of course.) But it just doesn’t go well with:

    “I’m not just about freedom for women, I’m about freedom for everyone,”

    Because freedom for everyone just isn’t more Hispanic history, it’s the history they want taught. It’s the freedom to choose what you (or your children), but only that, want to be taught.


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